Welcome back to the Word on Fire Show. I’m Matthew Petrusek, senior director of the Word on Fire Institute and the host of the Word on Fire Show. Thank you for joining us. In our last episode, Evangelization & Culture Podcast host Tod Worner began a conversation with Word on Fire’s founders about social media, in which they explored the art and means of communication. In this next segment, we’ll continue that conversation, now examining Catholic ministry and social media. What, if anything, does social media have to do with Pope St. John Paul II? How does it fit into Word on Fire’s own principles? How would one even define social media? Here to discuss these things with Tod Worner and Fr. Steve Grunow is Bishop Robert Barron.
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Welcome back to the Word on Fire Show. I’m Matthew Petrusek, senior director of the Word on Fire Institute and the host of the Word on Fire Show. Thank you for joining us. Today, we’re bringing you a special episode—a conversation from our very own Evangelization & Culture Podcast, hosted by Dr. Tod Worner. Recently, Dr. Tod, as we like to call him, sat down with Word on Fire CEO Fr. Steve Grunow and Bishop Barron to talk about social media. But rather than retread the usual tropes of social media conversations, Dr. Tod hosts a richer and more intimate conversation on the topic through the lenses of evangelization, art, communication, and more. Please enjoy this first segment, in which we’ll look specifically at the art and means of communication.
Topics Covered
00:00 | Introduction
00:55 | The importance—and challenge—of communication
05:00 | How the gospel spread before the use of mass media
10:51 | Art as evangelization
17:54 | Papal communication and early media
22:05 | Mass media figures and their influence on Word on Fire
27:51 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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Welcome back to the Word on Fire Show. I’m Matthew Petrusek, senior director of the Word on Fire Institute and the host of the Word on Fire Show. Thank you for joining us. As we continue this second half of a conversation from last year’s Good News Conference in Orlando with Bishop Barron and Word on Fire CEO Fr. Steve Grunow, we’ll discover the ministry’s patron saints, as well as some of the lessons that Word on Fire has learned through its years of evangelization. We’ll also take a look at Word on Fire’s plans for the future. Here to discuss these with Fr. Steve Grunow, in this second half of an hour-long conversation, is Bishop Robert Barron.
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The Enlightenment believed reason was its own authority. Heteronomous authority was anathema. Autonomy was the ideal. Thus, the Church's hierarchical structure was viewed as enslaving. In light of this critique, Newman offered an insightful defense of freedom and truth in the Catholic Church.
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Welcome back to the Word on Fire Show. I’m Matthew Petrusek, senior director of the Word on Fire Institute and the host of the Word on Fire Show. Thank you for joining us. In 2025, Word on Fire Catholic Ministries celebrated its twenty-fifth anniversary. And in October of that same year, Bishop Barron and Word on Fire CEO Fr. Steve Grunow gave a presentation at the Good News Conference in Orlando in which the two men took a deep dive into Word on Fire’s origins. How did it begin? What were its animating principles? What were some of its earliest strategies? Where did the name “Word on Fire” even come from? Why, in short, did Word on Fire develop the way that it did? Here to discuss these roots with Fr. Steve Grunow, in this first half of an hour-long conversation, is Bishop Robert Barron.
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Since the mind can infer truths of which it does not have certainty, what judges the validity of an inference in concrete matters? The Illative Sense. It is the power of judging and concluding when not having apodictic certainty. Bishop Barron explores Newman's analysis of the Illative Sense, explaining why it is an essential element in religious conversion.
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In a recent episode of the Joe Rogan show, evolutionary biologist and public intellectual Bret Weinstein observed that two emerging features of contemporary societies, especially, though not exclusively in the West, are challenging the very meaning and purpose of human life: 1) the decoupling of human sexuality from human reproduction—defining sex primarily as recreational and 2) with the rise of AI and robotics, the real possibility that having a job will become entirely optional in the future. By secular standards, pursuing both of these goals seems entirely rational, if not laudable: raising children and going to work are, indeed, challenging, so why shouldn’t we live in a world in which both become increasingly rare? Weinstein, however—who doesn’t profess adherence to any religious tradition—suggests that humanity may lose something important, if not essential, if we continue down this path. Is he right to be concerned? Is it, in fact, wise to relegate having children and going to work—which defined how most people spent most of their adult lives throughout history—entirely to the realm of subjective preference? Or, in seeking ever greater freedom from these responsibilities, are we undermining what it means to live a fully human life?
A listener asks: How can I respond to “God loves me the way I am”?
00:00 | Introduction
01:39 | Bishop Barron’s Christmas season
02:48 | Examining Bret Weinstein’s grim assessment
06:36 | Procreation as a sign of the covenant
09:34 | Why not frame children through the lens of lifestyle choice?
13:23 | The valorization of personal choice
16:31 | What about celibate priests?
17:52 | Work and technology
23:42 | Can AI or robotics truly replace the human genius?
25:48 | Limitations for using AI
28:06 | The necessity of work in giving a gift
30:02 | Why can’t technology help us create heaven on earth now?
33:01 | The active dimension of rest
37:03 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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An Essay in Aid of a Grammar of Assent was Newman's most difficult work. While not a formal epistemology (theory of knowledge), Newman prompted a movement away from modern epistemology, stressing certainty that is best found in logic and mathematics, to common sense epistemology, affirming truth that is not absolutely certain. Bishop Barron explains why this epistemology is proper to religious knowledge, which includes notional and real assent.
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St. Pope John Paul the II memorably observed that the Catholic Church comes from the eucharist and that the eucharist, in turn, comes from priests. As Bishop Barron noted in a recent letter to his diocese, “by an inescapable logic [therefore] no priests, no Church.” We should add, however, that priests come from bishops, which expands the ecclesial logic to this: no bishops, no priests; no priests, no eucharist; no eucharist, no church. In other words, bishops not only hold an important administrative position within the Church; tracing their authority back to the apostles and, ultimately, to Jesus Christ himself, they constitute the very sacramental and liturgical foundation of Catholicism itself. That, to say the least, is a weighty responsibility. So what is it like to be a bishop? How does one come to hold this office? What, specifically, do bishops have authority over–and what don’t they have authority over? What kind of relationship do they have with each other and with the Holy Father, the pope? What are their day-to-day obligations and activities? And what are some challenges they face that both clergy and laity may not be aware of?
A listener asks what made Bishop Barron want to be a priest.
01:38 | Bishop Barron’s Thanksgiving in Chicago
02:45 | The origins of the office of bishop
04:51 | The theological dimension of the bishop’s role
06:41 | The liturgical symbols of the office
10:45 | Bishop Barron’s coat of arms
12:12 | How does one become a bishop?
16:10 | How are dioceses formed?
17:20 | Relating bishop to archbishop
18:51 | Understanding the bishop’s authority
20:03 | What is a chancery?
21:03 | Essential tasks of the bishop
29:38 | Bishop Barron’s approach to his official duties
33:01 | The meaning and authority of a conference of bishops
37:19 | Myths about Catholic bishops
40:06 | Listener question: What made you become a priest?
41:41 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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Newman believed that a liberal arts education would instill a philosophical habit of mind in students, helping students reason to the foundational principles of every discipline and see how everything fits together. The philosophical habit of mind distinguishes between significance and triviality, helping society and individuals order everything to the Good.
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Religious freedom, especially for Christians, is under attack across the globe, including in the West–including right here in the United States. Whether insidiously in the form of diversity, equity, and inclusion programs that block Christians from employment and advancement opportunities, or, overtly, like vandalism against churches, or, in some parts of the world, murderous violence against Christians themselves, in terms of sheer numbers–and this fact is often ignored–Christians are, by far, the most persecuted religious group in the world. While defending religious freedom is important for people of all faiths, or no faith at all, it is thus especially urgent for believers in Christ. How, then, can we work together as a church and as a society to make progress on this front? Taking a step back, what, specifically, is religious freedom and why is it a universal human right? What is the relationship between the free exercise of religion and freedom of speech? And how can we respond to the secular charge that religious freedom is merely a backdoor means for the faithful to impose their beliefs on others?
A listener asks how we can grow in confidence that Catholicism is the one true religion.
00:00 | Introduction
01:36 | Concluding Winona-Rochester’s diocesan synod
03:24 | The work of the Religious Liberty Commission
07:33 | Responding to Religious Liberty Commission criticism
09:11 | The inherent priority of religious liberty
12:32 | Distinguishing the freedoms of religion, conscience, and speech
14:26 | Is religious liberty necessary for worship?
16:33 | Understanding “due limits” to religious liberty
19:33 | Proposition or imposition?
20:24 | Civil authority and religious authority
22:40 | Truth and relativism
27:25 | How poor conceptions of religion undermine religious liberty
28:27 | Advocating for religious liberty
30:06 | Religious freedom in society
31:36 | Why religious liberty matters for evangelization
32:48 | Listener question: How can we know Catholicism is true?
36:01 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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Theology is the queen of the sciences. It is not just one science among many but the principal organizing science. If it is taken out of this central organizing place, something else will take its place. In this lesson, Bishop Barron helps us understand why Newman thought theology was of crucial importance in education.
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A listener asks advice on how God being in a non-competitive relationship with human beings applies to his mission as an evangelist.
00:00 | Introduction
01:53 | Bishop Barron at the annual meeting of US bishops
03:39 | The three essential tasks of the Church
07:48 | The necessity of charity in true worship
09:04 | Understanding and identifying poverty
10:58 | The margins, the marginalized, and Catholic social teaching
16:08 | Understanding institutional sin
18:40 | The salvific dimension of poverty
21:17 | The voluntary poverty of the Church
22:57 | What about spending money on cathedrals?
26:03 | Beauty as service to the poor
27:11 | Defining “preferential option for the poor”
31:16 | The Church, policy, and the poor
35:18 | Right to private property or universal distribution of goods?
37:42 | The evangelical dimension of caring for the poor|
40:06 | Listener question: If God exists noncompetitively, does my mission matter?
41:45 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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Newman's articulation of the nature of university education in his The Idea of a University is crucial today in that a polytechnic model has replaced classical liberal education and theology has been exiled from most institutions.
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Charlie Kirk's assassination revealed a disturbing new cultural and political reality for those who share any of Kirk’s views: it is possible, in our day and age, to be shot for speaking your mind. How can we recover from this dark event, whose effects have reverberated across the globe? How can we reclaim the possibility of disagreement with each other without resorting to violence? What conditions must be in place to make civil debate both possible and productive again, especially as our society appears to be growing more polarized?
A listener asks for advice on a healthy way to end an argument when it’s clear you’re at an impasse.
00:00 | Introduction
02:19 | Praying at Planned Parenthood
03:17 | Bishop Barron and Charlie Kirk
08:58 | Athens, Jerusalem, and the West
14:49 | Two necessary conditions for meaningful dialogue
22:08 | Belief in God—the fundamental condition
24:50 | God and the priority of logos over will
26:34 | Do we really need God for human rights?
28:44 | The Catholic case for freedom of speech
29:54 | Public celebration of evil
33:05 | Violence as a response to speech
34:18 | How can we debate those who reject necessary conditions for dialogue?
35:27 | How forgiveness is possible when justice is wanted
36:42 | Evangelical lessons from Charlie Kirk
37:40 | Listener question: How do you walk away from an impasse?
39:57 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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In this lesson, Bishop Barron explains how Newman distinguishes between doctrinal development and corruption. A thorough explanation of this crucial issue requires a robust presentation of Newman's seven notes. Bishop Barron does just that!
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Pope Leo XIV has recently formally declared St. John Henry Newman—who was canonized only in 2019 by Pope Francis—a doctor of the Catholic Church, a recognition given only to 37 other saints in Catholicism’s over 2000 year history. This places Newman among great figures like St. Augustine, St. Gregory the Great, St. Jerome, St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Theresa de Avila, St. Catherine of Sienna, and the Little Flower, St. Therese of Lisieux. What is the significance of giving St. John Henry Newman—an Englishman and Anglican convert to Catholicism who was born over 200 years ago—this title? What is it about Newman’s approach to communicating the faith that earned him this great honor—and why now? Equally important, how can contemporary evangelists draw inspiration from his work to proclaim the Gospel in a drastically different world, religiously and morally, from Newman’s 19th century Victorian England?
A listener asks for advice on how to give better homilies at Mass.
00:00 | Introduction
01:26 | Bishop Barron’s recent domestic travels
03:20 | Defining “Doctor of the Church”
04:55 | Distinguishing doctors from saints
05:50 | John Henry Newman’s brief biography
12:18 | Understanding the development of doctrine
17:41 | Safeguards against corruption
22:33 | The wholeness of the truth
25:34 | Newman: “To live is to change”
29:28 | The “illative sense” of the mind’s assent to propositions
34:10 | Difficulties vs. doubt
35:54 | How Newman speaks to England now
37:55 | Listener question: How can priests improve preparation for homilies?
39:58 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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Newman thinks that the fullness of an idea can best be manifested when it enters the play of lively minds. It grows and develops through the Church. Newman's organic imagery opens up an interesting way of thinking about the difference between development and corruption in matters of doctrine.
The unveiling of ideas through the lively play of minds
Difference between development and corruption
The Prophetic Office
The Kingly Office
Video: Bishop Barron on the Development of Christian Doctrine
Read: Newman's Challenge by Stanley L. Jaki
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Newman's Essay on the Development of Christian Doctrine is perhaps his greatest contribution to theology. In this essay, Newman considers why "development" is an important lens through which to understand the Church and her teachings.
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In this lesson, Bishop Barron explains what led Newman to enter the Roman Catholic Church. Newman's study of Church history was part of it, giving a personal tinge to his famous quote: "To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant."
Newman's study of the Fourth Century theological controversies
Newman's suspicion of the Via Media
Newman's conversion to Catholicism
Attempts at reviving Catholic intellectual life
Article: Newman on Conversion
Video: Newman, Vatican II, and the Hermeneutic of Continuity
Read: Arians of the Fourth Century
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In this lesson, Bishop Barron presents Newman's autobiographical Apologia Pro Vita Sua, focusing on Newman's years as an Anglican prior to his conversion to the Catholic Church.
The Oxford Movement
Newman's study of the Arian Controversy
The Via Media
Tract 90
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In this lesson, Bishop Barron introduces St. John Henry Newman and explains his theological significance in his own day and ours. He is a pivotal player in Church history, being compared to St. Thomas Aquinas for his brilliance.
Topics Covered:
Major themes in Newman's writings
Biography of St. John Henry Newman
Influence on Vatican II
Apologia Pro Vita Sua
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We recently looked at some of the reasons that may be contributing to the resurgence or interest in Catholicism out in the culture. Today, we look at five suggestions on how we can preserve that momentum and hopefully increase it.
00:00 | Introduction
00:40 | Bishop Barron’s European trip to film new documentary
02:45 | The importance of a thinking Catholicism
06:18 | Recovering Catholic beauty
09:40 | Increasing online Catholic presence
12:51 | Continuing to engage the culture
14:54 | Examining evangelical courage
16:32 | Listener question
18:43 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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For 1,700 years, the universal church has confessed the Nicene Creed. This anniversary year, Bishop Barron spoke at a Greek Orthodox church in Rochester, Minnesota, to reflect upon the creed’s origins. Enjoy.
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Both interest and conversions to the Catholic Church have been surging both here and in parts of Europe, especially among young adults. To be sure, secularism still dominates the culture, but the once common wisdom that an increasingly secular society would eventually lead to the death of Christianity and its evacuation from the public square doesn’t seem so common anymore. What are the causes of this apparent religious revival among young people? What can we do as evangelists to maintain and build on the momentum?
A listener asks about the most effective way to make an initial evangelical impact on young people.
00:00 | Introduction
01:20 | Concluding Bishop Barron’s first diocesan synod
03:18 | Growing interest in Catholicism
08:45 | Men and Catholic interest
11:50 | Considering our recent isolations
14:08 | The rise and decline of wokeism
17:10 | Attraction to tradition
18:48 | Attraction to the liturgy
25:50 | The attraction of moral teachings
28:53 | Evangelical challenges
31:46 | Religious liberty
35:45 | Listener question: How do you best engage the young?
38:40 | Join the Word on Fire Institute
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